QuoteReplyTopic: To sue or not to sue... Posted: March 30 2006 at 8:36am
this is a facinating topic. As a hairdresser I find it especially interesting. I myself am not at all offended at what Suzy Q said. I actually feel awful that you all have had such awful experiances. I think what really hit it for me was when someone mentioned bringing a ruler to the salon. Well you know what, our combs actually have rulers on them, and I'm shocked no one has ever shown you there comb and asked you how much they want off. When I get a client that comes in for a trim, what I do is I show them an inch on my ruler,a nd tell them that this is an inch and ask if they want that much off. Sometimes they will hem and haw a bit, and then I ask them if they would only like half and inch off because I can always cut more, but I can't put it back on. They usually then want the half inch. I actually cut a little less than half an inch, and after I'm done sometimes they do want a little more off, but if they are very attached to there hair, then they usually are like "Oh this is great." So I'm shocked that your stylists aren't more careful with you.
As far as the prostitute thing, I knew she was not referring to us as prostitutes, I think what she was saying was, just because one is paid does not mean they are professionals, if so then prosititues or drug dealers(one I added) would be considered professional. Also I'm flattered that you are referring to hairdressers as professionals, we are actually not of the professional class we are trade workers, but we certainly should act like professionals.
The only excuses I can make on your negative experiances behalf would be these. 1. Hairstylists main fear in the world, is that someone will come in and ask for some horrible style, and we will give it to them, and then they will tell EVERYONE they know who did there hair. However what is wrong with this thinking, is people with awful taste, there friends know that they have awful taste, so therefore instead of thinking, gee snoopval just butchered my friends hair, they think, wow someone actually made my friend happy.
2. Yes I have to be honest, it is more fun to do drastic changes. Think of it this way, whatever jobs you have, there are more exciting days than others, if you are into interior decorating, yeah a coat of paint is exciting, but the client who wants you to turn there house into a replica of the set of whatever movie they just watched is much more facinating. Well sure it is our job to give trims and stuff, but it is a lot more fun to do drastic changes. However even if it is more fun, you are paying us to do what you want done, and two it's not smart bussiness sense. If I give you a dramatic change, you won't need to see me for awhile. If I trim a bit each time, I get to see you ever month.
Well sorry for my long post, I hope that I helped you all at least understand why some stylists do this, and I hope you realize that not all stylists are like this. Look around, and don't be afraid to spend a bit more, there are good hairdressers out there.
Such a stylist must be treated like any oher criminal. IMO, the victim has not only the right to sue the stylist, but even to revenge hiself / herself by all means.
I'm not an angry woman, I just expect to be respected. I am a rather petite, quiet person and as a result people try to walk all over me. Whether I am buying a car, furniture, or just getting my ends trimmed, I do not expect to be treated like an idiot or be bullied. Period. If someone in a career field feels insulted, just look at our big (or small) businesses elected leaders, even the so called compassionate UN! Some deserve our respect for making hard, unpopular decisions, and others that would sell our country down the river to the enemy for a few votes, deserve to be thrown out of their jobs. I don't want to start on party politics, I am just stating that I am aware there are sleazy characters out there. They have their own agenda and as a long haired woman, I do not want to let them bully me. BTW Thanks for the link to the self trim. I'll try the split end trimming, but for evening up the ends, I'll wait for a trusted friend. Maybe a guy friend or another long haired woman who understands the need for restraint when it comes to scissors and long hair. In the mean time, I'll just let it keep on growing. It does that very well by itself without interference. If I wear it up, french braided, in buns, etc., You can't tell if the ends needs to be evened. It just looks elegant.
eKatherine
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Going to the stylist for a trim is problematic for a number of reasons, but you need to calm down, Suzy. Getting angry doesn't help. They're not out to get you, you just need to understand where they're coming from so you don't get clipped.
First, many women go to the stylist when they aren't really sure of what they want. They ask for advice, the stylist naturally recommends a drastic change (it's what most people pay them to do, and it's probably what they're best at), and they allow the stylist to work his or her artistry. But afterwards, you're upset with the result, while many other women are satisfied giving the responsibility of choosing their hairstyle to the stylist.
What you need to do is not ask their advice. You may be sending out signals that you are unsure of what you want. They pick up on this, and make suggestions. If you do not respond decisively (perhaps you find stylists intimidating?), they have every reason to assume you do not care or agree with them.
If you aren't sure of what you want, don't go to the salon. Period.
Another problem is stylists trimming off more damaged hair than you intended, either by having a different idea of what "damaged enough to need to be cut off" than yours, or by going ahead and trimming all of the damaged part, though you intended to wait til next time to trim the rest off.
Again, you need to be very sure of what you want done. A ruler is good, show on it exactly how many inches you want taken off. Explain that this is the haircut you want and are willing to pay for. And do this before you sit in the chair.
I think, considering your current mindset, that you would probably be better off trimming your own hair. I do my own, a little bit at a time. It's easy to do, and you can do it when you see the need, as you don't need to make an appointment.
... I was foolish enough to believe they were supposed to be professional. But the definition of a professional is not limited to honorable or exemplary behavior, just getting paid for their work. So that would put them in the class with prostitutes. So lets not put anyone on a pedestal claiming to be a "professional".
Susy, I can really understand your anger about such hairstylists. Other professions have them too.
But to compare all hairdressers to prostitutes is really over the top. Many listen to and respect the wishes of their client. Many don't even mention changing something until asked for advice. Even then I refrain from suggesting something completely different until suggested by the client.
OK - long hair trims are no 'challenge' for hairdressers, we don't see long haired clients regularly (making the need for many of these customers to make a living), there are scissor happy hairdressers (you get the impression there's hardly a decent one in this world if you read the threads). But to put us at such a level, is simply not done. Please focus your anger on those who deserve it instead of lashing out at all.
I guess I get angry when someone else wants to control me or make my decisions. I had a really bad experience a few years ago and decided that I will take control up front and not be a victim. A scissor happy stylist robbed me of most of my hard earned length. I was foolish enough to believe they were supposed to be professional. But the definition of a professional is not limited to honorable or exemplary behavior, just getting paid for their work. So that would put them in the class with prostitutes. So lets not put anyone on a pedestal claiming to be a "professional". I will evaluate my situation on wh I can trust. My hair is growing long because it is "MY" choice. When a paid barber / stylist / hairdresser /etc. , claims to be somehow better than me, then tells me I don't know style and that they know better, that I really don't want a 1" trim, that cutting my hair to my shoulders and giving it chunky layers will give it volume, it what I really need irritates me. I don't want my hair sticking out in all directions. I want it long. Well I did walk out the last time, and I kept my hair from the butcher. The ends need a trim, but they can get that later (weeks even months). I had a boyfriend that used to trim my ends for me, but he took a job a few hundred miles away, and while we were really close, we weren't ready to commit. I think that my ends can wait until we get together in the late Spring when he visits his family or until I can find someone else I can trust with the scissors. In any event, I believe the proper course of action is not in the courts which favor the lawyers, not the victim, it is to not let someone take advantage of me first.
duke
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I don't believe in revenge, but I do believe there should be ways of legally enforcing our rights not to be harmed by businesses. I like my hair, it grows on my head, there are many ways in which I would rather be damaged than to have lots of my hair chopped off. The last post basically said it well. You have a RIGHT to have your hair on your head. The stylist is there to do what you tell them and not damage your hair. If they behave recklessly toward your hair, then you might sue them, not as revenge, but so that a legal precedent would be formed. If stylists know they can't just get away with damaging people's hair, maybe they won't be so arrogant as to fool around with it.
deltagirl12345
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I am so sorry to hear that. We have had many threads on this topic. I just get so mad with hair stylists that think they know so much more then we do, about how to wear our hair.
The opritive word here is - MY HAIR!
The bottom line is. IT's MY HAIR, I can do what I want. I PAY you to cut it or tirm it the way I say. If I want your advise I will ask for it. Other wise, just be quiet, and style my hair. I do not care what you want. Since I am paying the bill. It's what I want that counts.
YES - I can be a real witch at times. I am also proud of that. No one takes advantage of me.
I do not know if you could sue or not. I am sure the stylist would LIE and say you told her 5 inches. However, I would make sure to tell as many people as you can that this is a very bad place.
A long haired woman asks for a 1/2 inch trim of her waist length locks. The scissor happy stylist attempts to bully the woman into a bob cut. The woman offers to leave if the haircut zealot cannot honor her simple request and insists on intending to violate her. She advises that she will defend herself from the attacker if she is violated, but the stylist attempts to attack the woman's hair with scissors. Should the woman simply break fingers or press charges for assault? Is the threat of lethal force really needed or can a simple "NO" be respected by a stylist ? I asked for my ends trimmed and I had to threaten physical harm to the scissor weilder to be respected. I have a black belt and grabbed the man's hand and advised him to cease or I would protect myself. Why can't a woman simply be treated with respect in a salon? He should be thankful my boyfriend wasn't there. He would have broken bones.
Does it occur to anyone else that people posting on this thread think way to much of themselves or their own opinionsin this case? So I guess that makes me one of you doesn't it? lol! Still.......
HD_EU
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I think this is bull****, too many people sue for dumbass reasons. A lady got her hair cut and the person cut it too short, big goddamn deal. There are more important things in the world that should be taken into concern rather than worrying about a lady who didnt like her hair cut. Get ur damn minds straight and stop being so close-minded.
OK, so you're an unregistered user who revives a troll thread that's been dead for 5 years in order to write rude comments about women you don't know who have long hair. Your point?
Just looking for a few good hair slaves - is that too much to ask?
I think this is bull****, too many people sue for dumbass reasons. A lady got her hair cut and the person cut it too short, big goddamn deal. There are more important things in the world that should be taken into concern rather than worrying about a lady who didnt like her hair cut. Get ur damn minds straight and stop being so close-minded.
> Dear Diane from Canada:> First, let me say that I think Canada is the next best> country in the world after my own, and that I enjoy> travelling there, particularly in the Summer and> particularly in Vancouver and Victoria, BC. I also> like Toronto, Montreal, and London, Ontario.> Second, my mother was indeed short haired and very> mean to me while I was growing up. My grandmother had> long hair and was very nice to me. I am a sensitive> boy who feels safer with long haired woman.> DAVID, Esquirehello,david. after reading your response to this particular message i can see why you have some of the anger you do.i'm sorry you were mistreated by your mother growing up; however other short haired women are NOT HER!!! though i don't know you personally, it sounds as if you have a hard time not having everything under control and being flexable is a challenge. consider talking to someone on a professional basis; all that anger and other emotions do end up spilling out and harming yourself and others. best of luck in your evolution. p.s. i have long hair because i find it sensual-to please myself.
Jennifer Eve,Thanks for your response to DJL. I agree with what you said, and also with what Diane and Dave said.It's sad that DLJ has chosen to be so "into" the legal notion of rights that he does not think of his social *responsibilities* towards others, responsibilities that may not be spelled out in writing but which should be apparent to any person with a good heart. You would not want to live in a society where every person did every single action they had a legal right to do. Think about that for a few minutes.People are certainly entitled to their opinions, and I myself have personally felt over the years that many women I have seen would have been more attractive (in my own opinion) with long hair. But I am also mature enough to recognize that other people do not exist for my personal pleasure, that they are entitled to their own preferences, and that if I express my own preferences in an insensitive manner, then I will cause harm to others. (In certain cases, insensitivity may be justified, such as in response to great wrongdoing, but not merely as an indulgence of one's aesthetic preferences.)DLJ, you could say that you prefer long hair on women, or that you find it more attractive. But no, you say that women with short hair are ugly, period. It is apparent that you do not understand people and that you do not understand how to balance your own freedom with the needs of others. That is very sad.
I thank you for your historical input. While there may have been some eras when, and some cultures where, shorthaired women were tolerated, I think you will find that the overwhelming majority of the time, women wore long hair.In contemporary society, one's appearance, including hair, does communicate a message, and I rather like the message that women with long hair send. Long hair on a woman is a statement from a woman who cares about her appearance (long hair requires time and expense, and I know that from the hours my wife spends caring for her hair and the hundreds of dollars a year I am contractually obligated to spend for her shampoo, conditioner, and ornaments). It is a statement from a woman who cares about being feminine, and Lord knows, how much this world needs femininity, given all the havoc that we males wreak on it! (Maybe the society of the future will be a matriarchy composed of longhaired women).DAVID, Esquire> I have to contradict the statement about short haired> women being a recent phenomenon. If you had said> something about long hair having been the style for> women throughout most of history, I would have agreed> with you, but. . .> The ancient Egyptians, both genders, shaved their> heads and wore wigs, some of them short-haired.> Spartan women, on their wedding nights, cut their hair> short like boys'.> In the 18th century, both men and women wore wigs,> under which their heads were shaved. In their case,> the wigs were of elaborate styles presumably modelled> on long hair, but when wigs were no longer in vogue,> it took awhile for the hair to grow back out and thus,> in the Regency period, we had some shorter styles like> the Brutus cut, sported by the infamous Lady Caroline> Lamb.> These are isolated examples that come off the top of> my head (and my fellow historians may be groaning now,> as poorly cited as these are), and in any case only> counter the least objectionable part of your> statement. I can't address the rest without climbing> on my feminist high horse, which no one wants to see;> plus I can't improve on what the others have already> said.> Kim
> I do have long hair because I happen to look dorky with it cut short; even so, I'm confident that I could be "harsh" (whatever you may mean by that) if I wanted to be. Having read your response -- and I do thank you for writing -- I doubt that anything that I say will convince you that a long-haired woman is not necessarily trying to send a message of passivity, gentleness, or anything else in conformity to some kind of socially constructed femininity.Not that I have anything against femininity: in fact, when I came across some "cutting" sites, they freaked me out so badly that some of your remarks are *almost* welcome. Among the cutting stories that I have reviewed, punishment, essentially for being female, is easily the dominant theme and "defeminization" is a category all its own in the story archives. It's not cheerful reading.As for your conservative, businesslike haircut and the respect that it gets you ... . well, I'm happy for your sake, but it does depress me that a haircut of all things is the key to being taken seriously.Madelen
>>> Second, my mother was indeed short haired and very> mean to me while I was growing up. My grandmother had> long hair and was very nice to me. I am a sensitive> boy who feels safer with long haired woman.> DAVID, EsquireI am very sorry to hear that you are treated so badly in life as a child. It really pains me to hear this. Again I am very sorry.
Mark
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> David,Sometimes ladies with long hair,undergo chemotherapytreatments. After a series of chemotherapy treatments,many long hair ladies will lose all of their long hair.I have several ladies in my town,that lost all of theirlong hair,from chemotherapy treatments. These ladieslove long hair,but they will start to grow their hairback after the chemotherapy is finished. These ladieswill have short hair,for a long time,until their hair grows out to long hair,after several years. The main point is thatmedical conditions can prevent ladies from having longhair. A lady may end up with short hair,due to circumstances beyond her control.
Dear Lady Godiva,No reverse psychology. I honestly and sincerely believe that the world would be a better place if all women had long hair. How a woman wears her hair makes a statement about who she is. I am simply more comfortable with the statement that long hair makes.DAVID, Esquire> Well, David, consider this: your incredible misogyny> has lost you a potential friend in this very> longhaired woman. To base all your appreciation for> women on a single attribute renders you repulsive in> my opinion. How incredibly superficial you are. You> would cast aside hiring a struggling single mother> with short hair, who perhaps would be a better> employee than a longhaired woman, simply on the basis> of hair? This is laughable! It's attitudes like yours> which will prompt women to cut their hair, simply to> spite men like you. But perhaps that is your true> motive here: you may very well be a short hair lover> attempting to use reverse psychology to actually> encourage women to cut their hair. It's been seen here> before, so I understand. Well, I'm not biting. I don't> grow my hair for any man, and no man can influence me> to alter that. No woman can either, for that matter. I> feel really sorry for you to live such a shortsighted> life. You want this world to survive? Then get out of> the dark ages.> Laughing,> Jennifer Eve> PS. Diane, you were far too gracious with this guy.> But I applaud your approach anyhow. And Dave, you were> great, too. We need more men like you in the world.> Doesn't this sound all too familiar? Hugs to you both.
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Such a stylist must be treated like any oher criminal. IMO, the victim has not only the right to sue the stylist, but even to revenge hiself / herself by all means. 
Susy Q wrote:
