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To sue or not to sue...

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Deana View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Deana Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:45pm
> Oh, a lazy day for me! Yesterday I was extremely> active and got a lot of work done. Today, I'm vegging.> And I haven't even taken a shower or washed my hair> yet!Thanks, Jena, for wiping away my guilt. It's raining today and I don't feel like doing a dern thing! My greasy hair is in a ponytail, (Out of sight, out of mind?).Actually, I can't believe we admit to this!Deana.
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Jena View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jena Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:45pm
Why, my pleasure! {grin}> My greasy hair is in a ponytail, (Out of sight, out of> mind?).Well, think of it this way -- obviously every time we wash or "mess" with our hair, it causes a wee bit of stress (sure, not a lot, but a little...), so you're encouraging growth and optimal health today, right? ;-)
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Zorak View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Zorak Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:45pm
> If a business cannot provide customer service then they> shouldn't be in business...Lots of businesses do go under> because the lack of customer service.Oh, I absolutely agree with this, I just don't believe that filing a lawsuit is the answer. It costs a whole lot (Like I said, you are just not going to find a lawyer who will take this on a contingency fee basis, 'cause you ain't gonna get any real cash as damages), it is a real bummer to be deposed, and by the time your "day in court" arrives, the damage to your tresses is all over, because it will take about two ot three years to get to court!> No offense but you both have a bad attitude on this> because you are actually accepting that you as a> customer will not be taken seriously when you ask for> something. Don't expect to get your car etc fix> properly with your attitude.Wrong! A car being improperly fixed will have a WHOLE LOT more chance of getting damages awarded against the offending car repair extablishment, as opposed to some weepy woman who was unhappy with her haircut! Get real!And I do agree with part of what you said: if the supposed tort is a few inches of hair, YES you WILL have a very hard time being taken seriously in court!!!!> It is people like you that can easily give business a way> out to the lack of customer service.Actually, it is people who sue over a bad haircut that have brought the legal system to its knees with frivilous lawsuits.> Word of mouth makes or breaks those businesses.This is absolutely true, and may be the only real recourse for a person aggreived by a bad haircut.Z.
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PD View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:45pm
Thanks for your reply, Diane. I agree with you, that people should be careful in picking out stylists, and that most stylists are not sadistic hair abusers. They generally do what they are asked. I personally have never been to a stylist before...and don't intend to :) I don't have anything against them either. But did you ever notice how most salons have a huge drawing of scissors on their windows? ;) Hmmmm...Take care of yourself,PD> The bottom line is customer service and we should> really make sure we are using a stylist that is> professional and cares about their customer's needs.> Personally I think most stylist are very client> oriented and will listen to their client's needs. They> might makes suggestions which are always welcome when> we are searching for ideas.> I have often use their suggestions in the past.> I just feel that we should have any business> accountable for their customer service. What route we> take would really depend on the damage and what the> client decides.
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Lady Godiva View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lady Godiva Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:45pm
LOL! Except then the scalp becomes chock full of dead skin flakes, oils, lint, dirt and other grime, which impedes growth. Mmmmm, appetizing!Jennifer Eve> Well, think of it this way -- obviously every time we> wash or "mess" with our hair, it causes a> wee bit of stress (sure, not a lot, but a little...),> so you're encouraging growth and optimal health today,> right? ;-)
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Diane from Canada View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Diane from Canada Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:45pm
>> Wrong! A car being improperly fixed will have a WHOLE> LOT more chance of getting damages awarded against the> offending car repair extablishment, as opposed to some> weepy woman who was unhappy with her haircut! Get> real!Dear Zorak again you miss the point!>Well Zorak I am as real as it gets lol. The bottom line is that too many businesses get away with the lack of customer service.I have this friend from Japan that phoned here about his bike and he was told to F off so he decided to beef on the internet about it. Surprising enough he was told sorry.When one goes to a stylist they shouldn't need to be on the defense. Their wishes should be respected and if they are not respected as per a perm etc or whatever that customer should beef about it.You talk about court. Haven't you ever heard of small claims which hardly cost a dime to file? Maybe the states are diffirent but people use small claim courts all the time.But to be taken seriously one would have to do their research and find others customers etc.Personally I would only use a small claim court if the damage was severe but you better believe it that everyone would know.I strongly believe when we just allow the lack of customer service being done we give companies permission to not respect us as the customer and it is very wrong.Customer service is very rare these days. Look around. Can you really say you are treated the way you should be?
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Lady Godiva View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lady Godiva Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:45pm
Okay, Lady, how do I make this any clearer without really embarrasing ya? I can't, I'm sorry! I just can't do it any other way! Gosh, you even copied it...> (See TLHS/HairCare/Styles for what I mean by the> "wrapped" French twist - c'est moi!)site: TLHSclick on: Hair Careclick on: Styleslook for: red top and black slacks. Oh, and long, long hair.> I want to see! When I clicked on "gallery,"> are you the one on the bottom row, far right? I have> to say -- all those women have *gorgeous* hair!Yikes, I hope you're not mad with me!Jennifer Eve
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madelen View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote madelen Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:45pm
Interesting discussion! Seems to me that there is another issue in these matters that people seem a little hesitant to address. Depending on what info the hypothetical victim can dig up on "stylist", she *may* have grounds for charges of assault, theft, and fraud. If she finds out, for instance, that her ponytail is for sale in one of those venues that sell hair for sexual purposes (or even just ordinary purposes such as wigmaking), then she certainly has evidence of motive for theft of her hair.If she finds out that a video has been made of her haircut and is being distributed, especially to feed the appetites of men who get off on that sort of thing -- again, this could make it a criminal case.In short, if you have evidence of criminal motives such as malice, perversion, or gain, I would say that you would be honour-bound to turn over such evidence to the cops, the DA, or whomever. Let's face it folks: there are people out there who prey on women. Sadists and other less exotic criminals (as opposed to merely inept stylists) belong in jail. There is no "right" to exploit people.Admittedly, most cases won't fit this description. But please don't fall into the trap of assuming that it's just hair and therefore not really that important. Your hair is a part of your body and it deserves defence like any other part of you. Accept no violations: that's my advice.Madelenps, I've had the pleasure of reading your writings for the last week or so, but this is the first time I've written. If I sound hypervigillant, it's because I've been looking at some "cutting" sites. Holy mother of ... . !
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Lady Godiva View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lady Godiva Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:45pm
What did the thieves do with your cut hair, then? (I'm choosing to believe the interesting story!) Thanks for saving the world. I bow to thee, oh Mistress.Let the bangs grow out. It's fun. I'm doing it for the first time in my life.My hair was cut shorter because the stylist just kept doing it that way. In the end, it looked more like that old stupid pixie cut. Aaarrgghghhh!Yeah, I finally decided to take my morning shower at 8:15 tonight. Now I think I need breakfast!Jennifer Eve
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Diane from Canada View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Diane from Canada Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:45pm
> Okay, Lady, how do I make this any clearer without> really embarrasing ya? I can't, I'm sorry! I just> can't do it any other way! Gosh, you even copied it...> site: TLHS> click on: Hair Care> click on: Styles> look for: red top and black slacks. Oh, and long, long> hair.> Yikes, I hope you're not mad with me!> Jennifer EveI really love that wild look. Have you ever tried it?Diane
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Ally View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Ally Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:45pm
You can sue for anything. It's a question of whether you can win.Similar cases have been tried. The plaintiff never wins. Why? The court's view is that a too-short haircut is not permanent damage. The hair will grow back. And these were cases where women had /lost/ their hair due to a bad bleach job.Now, I'd like to see what would happen if the woman shorn made a case that her long hair had been an important part of her job.I've experienced the grief of hair butchery, but I'm not sure "victims" should be able to sue and win. Think of the avalanche of silly lawsuits one victory might set off.Ally
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Erika Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:46pm
Hi Diane,> Eventhought the client wouldn't win the publicity> would damange the salon anyways.You have hit on exactly the reason why I would at least consider small claims court in te extremely unlikely situation that a beautician cut off a large amount of my hair against my wishes. If such a thing happened (the chin-length thing in my first post was just an example I pulled out of the air, I'd start to seriously consider revenge on this scale after the loss of one foot) I can see myself doing just about everything that I legally (and reasonably) could do to damage the reputation of this stylist/salon in the hopes that I would make them lose money and possibly (for the stylist) get fired. My plan would also include things like letters to the editor. Of course, this scenerio isn't likely to happen. I'm very careful about who I let cut my hair, and I think that the first thing that would tip me off to the fact that they were cutting too much would be that they were cutting my hair without either asking me to stand up or using a booster seat. And, as I said before, I have never had more than one inch over what I asked for taken off.Erika:-) :-) :-)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bb Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:46pm
> You can sue for anything. It's a question of whether> you can win.> Similar cases have been tried. The plaintiff never> wins. Why? The court's view is that a too-short> haircut is not permanent damage. The hair will grow> back. And these were cases where women had /lost/> their hair due to a bad bleach job.> Now, I'd like to see what would happen if the woman> shorn made a case that her long hair had been an> important part of her job.> I've experienced the grief of hair butchery, but I'm> not sure "victims" should be able to sue and> win. Think of the avalanche of silly lawsuits one> victory might set off.> AllyI've just been reading this thread, but now that you have mentioned something about the woman's hair being part of her job, I'll relay something I read a few years ago in the news.There was a model (I think this case was is Arizona) who was asked to appear on a local magazine-type show about hairand this particular segment was going to be about "how to trim long hair". Prior to the show being taped, the producers, hairdresser and model had all agreed that no more than 6" were to be trimmed off of her knee-length hair.The stylist had her turn her back to the cameras and made the first snip at just below her SHOULDERS. He had cut off three and a half FEET of this poor girls hair with the first cut!!!!!!!! Of course, on TV especially, there was no stopping now until he had "trimmed" her hair all the way across at just below her shoulders.Of course she was in complete shock and horrified by what had just happened!!!!!!Not only did she sue, since she was a model, but a JURY ordered the stylist to pay her for her unwanted and negligent haircut. Her three and a half foot ponytial was all the jury needed to see and their verdict was exactly what the headline of the article said:"HAIR DEEMED WORTH $7,500.00"True story!!!!!!!!bb
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Carolyn B View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Carolyn B Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:46pm
I live in Iowa and have never heard of such a thing happening. If it did I think it might make the newspapers. We don't have a lot of hot news out here! LOL! I have lived here almost 25 years and have had my hair trimmed by at least 6 different stylists in 4 different places and none has butchered my hair. The worst that has happened to me was a 2" trim instead of 1" and a couple of bad bang trims. Please all of you out there don't judge people or stylists in Iowa by the comments of "Cindy", "Judy" or "JR". I have recently found a great stylist who knows exactly what 1/2" is. Maybe I could reccommend her to Cindy-Judy-JR ! I agree that the style of writing is the same and the word choices and sentence structure are kind of stilted and peculiar. Oh well, I guess it takes all kinds to make the world go 'round!
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Lady Godiva View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lady Godiva Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:46pm
What do you mean, Diane? Wild from being mad? Or some other hair style on that page?Jennifer Eve> I really love that wild look. Have you ever tried it?> Diane
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:46pm
Interesting how if you say that your hair was an important part of your job, you may win the lawsuit. But if you say that it was an important part of your personality, you won't. So jobs are more important than personality? I don't get it. Isn't there something wrong with the way that our courts make value judgements?PD> I've just been reading this thread, but now that you> have mentioned something about the woman's hair being> part of her job, I'll relay something I read a few> years ago in the news.> There was a model (I think this case was is Arizona)> who was asked to appear on a local magazine-type show> about hair> and this particular segment was going to be about> "how to trim long hair". Prior to the show> being taped, the producers, hairdresser and model had> all agreed that no more than 6" were to be> trimmed off of her knee-length hair.> The stylist had her turn her back to the cameras and> made the first snip at just below her SHOULDERS. He> had cut off three and a half FEET of this poor girls> hair with the first cut!!!!!!!! Of course, on TV> especially, there was no stopping now until he had> "trimmed" her hair all the way across at> just below her shoulders.> Of course she was in complete shock and horrified by> what had just happened!!!!!!> Not only did she sue, since she was a model, but a> JURY ordered the stylist to pay her for her unwanted> and negligent haircut. Her three and a half foot> ponytial was all the jury needed to see and their> verdict was exactly what the headline of the article> said:> "HAIR DEEMED WORTH $7,500.00"> True story!!!!!!!!> bb
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote PD Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:46pm
Truth? Who the heck cares about truth. We're talking about our national justice system, remember? Try money instead. Money is bound to get you farther than truth can. Hey, we're a capitalist society! This is the way we like it!> Truth is a defense against libel and slander, but do> you really want to be taken to court so that you can> try to use truth as a defense???
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jeffrey Hines Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:46pm
Carolyn,My comment was in no way meant to put down people in Iowa. I was just making a joke about the fact there seemed to so many Iowan's who had buzzcuts against their wishes. Yes Cindy, JR & Judy are one in the same. That much I can prove. But I'm sure that most Iowan's are not into buzzcuts.Jeff.
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Diane from Canada View Drop Down
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> What do you mean, Diane? Wild from being mad? Or some> other hair style on that page?> Jennifer EveJennifer on the same page it at the bottom they show this model with blonde hair and it is called the wild look.
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David Justin Lynch View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote David Justin Lynch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: January 11 2000 at 9:46pm
> Ok, here's a hypothetical situation (which isn't so> hypothetical: it's happened before). A long haired> person goes to a salon to get the hair trimmed one> inch. And I repeat, ONE INCH. The person makes this> clear to the stylist. The stylist takes off five or> six inches. The no longer long-haired person gets> angry and threatens to sue. Do you think s/he has the> right to sue, or do you think this is not a big enough> deal to take to court? I would say, go on and sue the> stylist.I am a lawyer, and here is my opinion.Cutting a woman's hair short is a most egregious act in and of itself, and should be, in my opinion, a crime,(but is not).A short haired woman is but one more ugly creature on the planet, but if it is done against a woman's will, you better believe she should sue. And I would be happy to take the case. You have breach of contract and battery. The agreement between the client and the stylist is to perform per client instructions. And if you touch someone in a harmful manner beyond what that person has consented, you have battery.DAVID JUSTIN LYNCH, Esquire
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